122: Narrative vs. Reality -- Whitney, Jeremy & Michelle Discuss Brian Hales - Pt. Two

122: Narrative vs. Reality -- Whitney, Jeremy & Michelle Discuss Brian Hales - Pt. Two

Please consider supporting this podcast:

Venmo: @Michelle-Stone-24

Patreon.com/132problems


The second (and best) half of our first panel discussion on Brian Hales' false claims and opaque "transparency." We discuss Brian's oft repeated claim that no leader (or "keyholder" LOL) ever said why God "commanded" polygamy.


There is an embarrassment of riches when choosing quotes to expose just how seriously false this claim is. It was amazing to see what we each came up with. Good stuff in this one!


I'm hoping Brian and others will take notice that lies will not stand. We take these and all other scriptures seriously:


"Therefore, that we should waste and wear out our lives in bringing to light all the hidden things of darkness, wherein we know them; and they are truly manifest from heaven—

These should then be attended to with great earnestness.

Let no man count them as small things; for there is much which lieth in futurity, pertaining to the saints, which depends upon these things." (D&C 123:13-15)

https://www.churchofjesuschrist.org/study/scriptures/dc-testament/dc/123?lang=eng


Links:

Orson Pratt, The Seer: https://catalog.churchofjesuschrist.org/assets/2719f45e-8475-4fc4-823a-ab193aefa084/0/136


Brigham Young, July 14, 1855: Journal of Discourses, Vol. 3, pp. 264-268

https://jod.mrm.org/3/264


Erastus Snow October 4, 1857: Journal of Discourses, Volume 5, pp. 285-292

https://jod.mrm.org/5/285


Heber C. Kimball Feb 1 1857 : Journal of Discourses, vol. 4, pp. 207-213

https://jod.mrm.org/4/207


Brigham Young, July 6, 1862: Journal of Discourses, Vol. 9, pg. 322

https://jod.mrm.org/9/318


Brigham Young, August 9 1868: Journal of Discourses, Vol. 12, pg. 261

https://jod.mrm.org/12/255


John Taylor 1883: Journal of Discourses, Vol. 24, pg. 229

https://jod.mrm.org/24/227


John Taylor Revelation Sept 27, 1886: Brian Hales paper, https://mormonpolygamydocuments.org/wp-content/uploads/2020/10/1886-Revelation-article.pdf


Joseph F. Smith, July 7, 1878: Journal of Discourses, vol. 20, pg. 28

https://jod.mrm.org/20/24


George Q. Cannon November 16, 1884: Journal of Discourses, vol. 25, pp. 360-371

https://jod.mrm.org/25/360


Brigham Young, August 19, 1866: Journal of Discourses, Vol. 11 pg. 268

https://jod.mrm.org/11/266


December 19, 1891 Petition for amnesty

https://digitalcommons.law.ou.edu/cgi/viewcontent.cgi?article=7160&context=indianserialset


Chapters:

0:00 Intro


2:30 Polygamy damages marriages


10:05 Brian Hales: We don’t know why God commanded polygamy


20:15 Orson Pratt's reasons for polygamy


25:10 Prostitution or polygamy?


42:45 Brigham Young’s reasons for polygamy


50:00 Polygamy required for exaltation?


59:50 Erastus Snow: a woman’s lord is her husband?


1:02:20 Heber C. Kimball: thousands of wives!


1:03:50 Brigham Young: monogamy is no part of heaven


1:09:30 Brigham Young: polygamy for moral salvation of world


1:11:15 Joseph F. Smith: polygamy essential for highest blessings


1:16:00 George Q. Cannon: few righteous men, so we need polygamy?


1:18:00 Bloodlines


1:19:29 Q12, John Taylor: polygamy necessary to salvation


1:32:51 Brian Hales' narrative destroys faith


1:34:25 Final thoughts

Avsnitt(167)

7: The Emergence of Section 132 | 132 Problems: Revisiting Mormon Polygamy

7: The Emergence of Section 132 | 132 Problems: Revisiting Mormon Polygamy

Please consider supporting this podcast: Venmo: @Michelle-Stone-24 https://www.patreon.com/132Problems This episode takes a deep dive into the 1852 special conference where polygamy and 132 were revealed. We’ll discuss what was asked of the Saints and consider their actual experiences, and we’ll compare the contrasting prophecies surrounding plural marriage as a means to discover truth. Polygamy denials: https://mormonpolygamydocuments.org/chart-twenty-three-polygamy-denials/ Joseph Smith, "I am bold to declare I have taught all the strong doctrines publicly, and always teach stronger doctrines in public than in private." https://www.josephsmithpapers.org/paper-summary/discourse-16-june-1844-a-as-reported-by-thomas-bullock/1 August, 1852, Special Conference where 132 was revealed: https://archive.org/details/specialconferenc00chur/page/26/mode/2up

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6: Abraham's Polygamy -- 132 Problems: Revisiting Mormon Polygamy

6: Abraham's Polygamy -- 132 Problems: Revisiting Mormon Polygamy

Please consider supporting this podcast: Patreon Link: https://www.patreon.com/132Problems A deep dive into the story of Abraham, Sarah, and Hagar, which is the foundation for all claims of God ordained polygamy. Genesis 11-22 Genesis 12:19 - various translations: https://biblehub.com/niv/genesis/12-19.htm

3 Sep 202250min

5: Doctrine & Covenants Teachings on Marriage -- 132 Problems: Revisiting Mormon Polygamy

5: Doctrine & Covenants Teachings on Marriage -- 132 Problems: Revisiting Mormon Polygamy

Please consider supporting this podcast: Patreon Link: https://www.patreon.com/132Problems We look at the totality of teachings on marriage in the revelations of the restoration and learn the history of the Doctrine and Covenants, including the original section 101. Links: History of the D&C: https://eom.byu.edu/index.php/Doctrine_and_Covenants_Editions https://www.churchofjesuschrist.org/study/ensign/1984/12/the-story-of-the-doctrine-and-covenants?lang=engOriginal Section 101: https://www.josephsmithpapers.org/paper-summary/doctrine-and-covenants-1835/259#full-transcript Meeting to accept the 1835 Doctrine and Covenants: https://www.josephsmithpapers.org/paper-summary/minutes-17-august-1835/7#full-transcript Trial of Your Faith by Elder Anderson, October 2012: https://www.churchofjesuschrist.org/study/general-conference/2012/10/trial-of-your-faith?lang=eng

28 Aug 202241min

4: Book of Mormon Evidence of Polygamy | 132 Problems: Revisiting Mormon Polygamy

4: Book of Mormon Evidence of Polygamy | 132 Problems: Revisiting Mormon Polygamy

Please consider supporting this podcast: Patreon Link: https://www.patreon.com/132Problems What does the Book of Mormon have to say about marriage and polygamy? (It might just be more than you realized.) Scriptures referenced: Jacob 2:24-35 Jacob 3:5-7, 12-13 Mosiah 11:2-4 Mosiah 19:9-12 Ephesians 5:25 Mosiah 20:1-5 Ether 10:5-7 3 Nephi 26:6-10 D&C 84:54-58 D&C 93:39 Links: Mothers of the largest families: https://www.therichest.com/the-biggest/10-mothers-who-gave-birth-to-the-most-children-ever/ TLC Clip: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=16A4YMlVs-A

10 Juli 202241min

3: God's Establishment of Marriage | 132 Problems: Revisiting Mormon Polygamy

3: God's Establishment of Marriage | 132 Problems: Revisiting Mormon Polygamy

Please consider supporting this podcast: Patreon Link: https://www.patreon.com/132Problems We're diving into God's establishment of marriage in Genesis, Moses, and Abraham. Where did marriage come from? What did God create and command? When did polygamy begin?

10 Juli 202223min

2: The Loophole (Jacob 2:30) | 132 Problems: Revisiting Mormon Polygamy

2: The Loophole (Jacob 2:30) | 132 Problems: Revisiting Mormon Polygamy

Please consider supporting this podcast: Patreon Link: https://www.patreon.com/132Problems We're taking a deeper look at Jacob 2:30, the famous loophole to God's prohibition on polygamy.

10 Juli 202228min

1: Introductions | 132 Problems: Revisiting Mormon Polygamy

1: Introductions | 132 Problems: Revisiting Mormon Polygamy

The first episode in the 132 Problems podcast. I introduce myself and the podcast and explain my journey with polygamy.

10 Maj 202213min

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